2019 Billiards League AGM
Wednesday 31 July 2019 at Chandlers Ford Central 7.30pm
PROPOSALS AND SUGGESTIONS FOR 2019 AGM NOW CLOSED
Please make sure at least one representative from your team is present.
Proposed by Tony Aldridge, Totton Rec 8.6.2019
PROPOSAL NUMBER 1
I suggest the maximum handicap should be put up to +125.
Some players are struggling on +110.
NOT CARRIED
Proposed by Chris Bishop, St Denys Cons 15.7.2019
PROPOSAL NUMBER 2
Firstly to attract more entrants to the Gordon lewis scr I propose making it seeded group games then a A semi then final and a B semi then final, as at the moment I think people avoid the competition because most feel they will only get one game and no chance of winning.
Seconded by Paul Lawrence, Park Gate RBL
CARRIED. (Chris and Andy will provide details later)
PROPOSAL NUMBER 3
Secondly a new scr 100up matchplay competition (maybe called Sid Reid matchplay) which would add something different and also at the moment if you have a bad start in Gordon Lewis it turns into a procession so having a best of 5 100up comp would give everyone a chance with the scores being reset, I have played quite a few matches against Andy to test out the duration and it has turned out to be so good that is how we now play our practice sessions.
During our time playing this format it has always finished 3-2 normally with Andy taking 2-0 lead and some games have finished with scores of 100-4 and 100-12 but still ended finishing 3-2 so gives you hope right until the end. All the matches we have played the longest was 2hr20min so as you get deeper into tournament (semi and final) it would go to best of 7 then best of 9 although it could be best of 9 in semi and best of 11 in the final as the finalists are likely to rattle through it pretty quick.
NOT CARRIED
2018 Billiards League AGM
Thursday 23 August 2018 at Chandlers Ford Central 7.30pm
PROPOSALS AND SUGGESTIONS FOR 2018 AGM
Proposed by Mark Spridgeon (Hamble Social)
1. Matches to be played in handicap order rather than drawn from the hat.
NOT CARRIED
2. Maximum handicap adjustment – set to +110.
CARRIED
3. No coaching allowed – no matter what the standard of player (penalty if no prior agreement from opponent).
AGREED
4. If you win an individual cup competition you should receive an automatic reduction in handicap.
CARRIED. IF YOU WIN THE STUART HAMPER CHALLENGE YOU WILL LOSE 10 POINTS
Proposed by Nick Wood (Hamble Social)
1. Maximum handicap given to super league & premier league snooker players. We agreed a few years ago about having +50 for this, but that seems to have gone out of the window. Playing decent snooker players with a +100 or higher handicap is often a waste of time.
AGREED
2. A reminder that all tables are to be ‘match ready’.
AGREED
3. Mixed club billiards pairs. This got knocked back a few years ago, but thought I’d float the idea again. Might not get everyone interested, but might get at least 8 pairs wanting to participate.
NOT CARRIED
4. Re-introduce the snooker pairs competition as it is the Southampton and District Billiards and Snooker Association Minimum requirement of 6 matches played to allow entry.
NOT CARRIED
5. I know this one irks a lot of people. Talking during matches needs to be looked at. I know it’s supposed to be a friendly evening, however there is a competition element to it. Can all captains agree to ask their teams/supporters to respect players when they are at the table. There are definitely occasions where there is silence from spectators when their player is at the table, but then just start talking and making noise when the opponent is playing.
AGREED
6. A weekly player stats update would be good (alongside the revised weekly handicaps).
A good visual to see the form of upcoming opponents and improving players.
NOT CARRIED
Proposed by Tony Aldridge / Paul Lawrence (Totton Rec / Park Gate RBL)
1. Propose a new scoring for points in the winter league. re: 2 points for winning a game, and 1 point if a player loses by 20 or less.
NOT CARRIED
2017 Billiards League AGM
Wednesday 16 August 2017 at Chandlers Ford Central 7.30pm
PROPOSALS AND SUGGESTIONS FOR 2017 AGM
Please make sure at least one representative from your team is present.
Rule amendments / suggestions ARE NOW CLOSED
MINUTES OF THE ANNUAL GENERAL MEETING OF THE SOUTHAMPTON & DISTRICT BILLIARDS AND SNOOKER ASSOCIATION
HELD AT CHANDLERS FORD CENTRAL CLUB ON 16 AUGUST 2017
PRESENT: Peter Green (Churchills) Chairman
Paul Adams (Churchills) Press Officer/Results Sec
Terry Azor (Chandlers Ford)
John Mullane (Chandlers Ford)
Clive Gamblin (Curdridge RBL)
Gwen Gamblin (Curdridge RBL)
Derek Fry (Curdridge RBL)
Tony Aldridge (Totton Rec)
Mike Kunzi (Totton Rec)
Chris Pullen (Park Gate RBL)
Steve Boterhoek (Park Gate RBL)
Mike Thatcher (Chandlers Ford)
Mark Emm (St Denys Cons)
Chris Bishop (St Denys Cons)
Mike Henstredge (Churchills)
David White (Chandlers Ford)
ITEM 1 – APOLOGIES
Apologies were received from Sid Hunt (President), Simon Green (Churchills), John Oldfield (Sarisbury) and Chris Christodoulou (Park Gate RBL).
ITEM 2 – MINUTES OF PREVIOUS AGM (17 Aug 2016)
It was proposed by Mike Thatcher, seconded by Derek Fry that the published Minutes of the previous AGM be accepted as the true record of the proceedings.
Carried
ITEM 3 – MATTERS ARISING
There were no matters arising.
ITEM 4 – ELECTION OF OFFICERS
The Chairman (Peter Green) and Results Secretary/Press Officer (Paul Adams) indicated their willingness to continue in office, if elected. In the case of the President we will need some discussion with Sid as to whether he will be carrying on as the Association Treasurer for the 2017-2018 season and in the future.
Some disappointment was expressed that there appeared to be long delays in the presentation of the various trophies. Tony Aldridge kindly agreed to take over the trophy arrangements in conjunction with the President for the future. It was proposed by Clive Gamblin, seconded by Chris Pullen that the current Association officers should be re-elected.
Carried
ITEM 5 – ASSOCIATION ACCOUNTS
In the absence of the Treasurer, The Chairman confirmed that the Balance Sheet showed a satisfactory position financially. This position would be further improved when some outstanding debts were recovered. It was proposed by Derek Fry, seconded by Chris Pullen that the published Accounts be accepted.
Carried
ITEM 6 – PROPOSALS OR AMENDMENTS TO EXISTING RULES
1. The Chairman opened the discussion by pointing out that there were 9 proposed rule changes, of which 3 had been seconded. Paul Adams had made a suggestion that reducing the teams from 5 to 4 might have some advantage, particularly as a means of obviating late finishes. The Chairman emphasised that this suggestion impinged on the relevance of the majority of the other eight proposals. After considerable discussion, it was unanimously voted to continue with 5 players per team.
Carried
2. John Mullane proposed, seconded by Derek Fry, that all matches should start at 7.30pm, with at least one match commencing at 7.30pm or 7.45pm at the latest. After 7.45pm two games must be playing. Unless there are extreme circumstances prevailing.
Carried
3. It was proposed by Mike Kunzi, seconded by Mike Thatcher that the maximum and minimum handicaps be fixed at +125 and -250.
Carried
4. It was proposed by Terry Azor that matches should be played with, where possible, opponents of matching ability playing each other.
Not Carried
5. It was proposed by Tony Aldridge that in the event of the league being reduced to teams of four, a doubles match to be added.
Not Carried
6. It was proposed by Clive Gamblin that in the event of a team having only four players, the captain of the team can elect one of his players to play twice.
Not Carried
7. It was proposed by Paul Adams, that the referee, after a player has potted the red from the spot, should announce the score, adding “and one” as a guide to the players.
Not Carried
8. It was proposed by Paul Lawrence that all games in the League should be of a maximum of one hour (or whoever) reaches 200 points first.
Not Carried
9. It was proposed by Chris Bishop, that in the event of a close game, where the margin of defeat is less than 10 points, the loser should not have his handicap increased by 5 points under the present rules.
Not Carried
ITEM 7 – CORRESPONDENCE
No relevant correspondence has been received.
There being no further business, the Chairman closed the Meeting at 20.30 thanking all for attending and expressing his thanks on behalf of the Association to the Chandlers Ford Central Club for permitting the AGM to be held on its premises.
Peter Green Chairman August 2017
DEREK FRY, CURDRIDGE RBL
Hi Paul
Just a last minute proposal, or topic for discussion.
If we have to go down to teams of 4 players ( hope we don't ) why not play a fifth game as a doubles game, using the team with five players, the one missing out on the draw, partnered by a drawn again player. If both teams have 4 players, it is done again on random draw method.
Hope this all makes sense, just a thought for discussion.
Regards
Derek Fry ( Curdridge RB L )
NOT CARRIED
PAUL LAWRENCE AND PAUL ADAMS, PARK GATE RBL AND CHURCHILLS EASTLEIGH
Games to be a maximum of 1 hour in duration or whoever reaches 200 points first
A timer is started for each game and will run for one hour. The winner is the player in the lead at the one hour buzzer or whoever reaches 200 points within that hour
Current handicap system to stay the same but with discussion on maximum minus and maximum plus handicaps for a fair game over an hour
Games to start at 7.30pm with at least 2 players from both sides available
NOT CARRIED
TERRY AZOR, CHANDLERS FORD CENTRAL
Hi Paul, the following is my proposal for the AGM.
I suggest that players 1-5 should play in order of their handicaps. I don't believe there is any enjoyment or satisfaction in player 1 or 2 competing against a 4/5 player or visa versa. I also feel that players should battle against similar handicaps, where possible not make up over 250 + starts. I believe the above would benefit the league and the results would be a lot closer because of it.
It would also be good to see capping of both ends of the handicapping.
Many thanks.
Terry.
NOT CARRIED
CLIVE GAMBLIN AND BRIAN BULL, CURDRIDGE RBL
Hi Paul,
Clive has asked me to put a proposal forward and I am happy to second it (if a player from the same team can second), here is the proposal...
If a team turns up with just 4 players, team captain of the short team elects a player to play twice, exact details of the election process/timing to be discussed.
This obviously wouldn't necessarily be relevant if proposal 1 below is passed (teams play with 4 players) but may be another option to discuss at the same time.
Thank you
Brian
NOT CARRIED
PAUL ADAMS, CHURCHILLS EASTLEIGH
1. A local Portsmouth billiards league custom that I think is good idea and maybe we should also take on.
When a referee calls the score out after potting the red off the top spot, he shall call out the score and “and one” after the first red off the spot is potted, or “and two” after the second red is potted.
Derek Foster has advised me that this happens in the Portsmouth billiards league and is a considerate way of informing all concerned. Obviously not a standard rule but a ‘friendly’ way to help all of us in the heat of battle!
Proposed by Paul Adams. Seconded by Derek Foster
2. I have had some feedback over the previous season that some matches are still starting at nearly 8pm. What with handicaps making games longer, this late starting is contributing to matches finishing later than is acceptable for some players. Our rules state that matches start at 7.30pm. I know that with car parking restrictions at some clubs and players travelling in one or two cars that it isn’t always possible to start at 7.30pm. But to start at nearly 8pm is unacceptable.
It puts a strain on players playing late. Not fair on players that have to be up early the following morning. Leaves little time for us to sit down and enjoy the after match food and have a convivial chat. I think we need to do something about it. Whether we change the handicap system so that the games are shorter, or radically, we go down to 4 players per team so there is more time to ‘enjoy’ the evening – I don’t know. I have been told that Portsmouth Billiards league has a different handicap system that we could look into which supposedly makes it fairer for players as well. Obviously all open to discussion
1. Teams to go down to four players per team. To discuss NOT CARRIED
2. Handicaps to be adjusted so that matches finish earlier. To discuss NOT CARRIED
3. Highest plus handicap for any player to be +125. To discuss CARRIED
Addition of maximum minus handicap to be -250 CARRIED
4. Handicap system to be tweaked / changed. To discuss NOT CARRIED
TONY ALDRIDGE, TOTTON REC - AMENDMENT
Hi Paul
further to my proposal for a "new Format" team competition, my players have played this out and have come up with an amendment to the original.
A New "Aldridge" Billiards team KO format
teams to comprise 3, 4, 5 or 6 players
all games 30 minutes on the clock
use of 2 tables
4 games on each table
Handicaps to be 40% of current league individual h/caps.
Once these eight games are complete captains nominate 3 players to compete in a final 30 minutes of "3 hand billiards" on table 1. one home player two away players on table 2. two home players one away player.
On going to the table' each player has the choice of playing with either white or yellow, from the current position, to complete his break.
The break continues until you fail to score. Any foul is 2 points to the other 2 players on that table.
If, on coming to the table, one cue ball is in the pocket, you must use that ball from any where in the "D", if at least one object ball is in play (i.e. not in baulk)
If both object balls are in baulk, the oncoming player places the potted cue-ball on the "blue" spot and then chooses to play with white or yellow.
If in the course of your break, you "Double-baulk" yourself then you must either attempt to score off a cushion outside baulk or play away (2 points to each opponent)
general billiards rules apply.
amended Proposed by Tony Aldridge (Totton Rec) 12th July 2017
Thanks Paul
NOT CARRIED. But with a proviso of Tony possibly trialling the competition at the end of the season after all league and existing cup competitions have been completed
CHRIS BISHOP, ST DENYS CONS
Hi I would like to thank everyone for welcoming me to the Southampton billiards league this season, I didn't know anyone before I started but I have thouroughly enjoyed playing and met some great people.
The running of the league and the website is particularly good, very informative with individual player stats and is kept up to date.
I would like to make a couple of suggestions regarding handicaps which is:
1, if a game finishes 200 - 196 for example this would suggest that handicaps are correct and shouldn't be changed for the following fixture, I would say if you scored over 185 for example they should remain the same.
2, every player should have to score a minimum amount of points, having a player only needing 50 points or less does not help them improve and can result in a very short game if they were to have the slightest run or bit of fortune, maybe a cap at +125 or around that mark would help even if it meant every other players handicap changed slightly to allow for the extra points (this would actually help if teams go down to 4 players as everyone would get more playing time).
Hope this makes sense and look forward to next season.
Regards
Chris
NOT CARRIED
CHRIS CHRISTODOULOU, PARK GATE RBL
Hi Paul,
just a couple of little ones.
AGM to be trophy selection night as well, we have got into the habit of players
waiting twelve months or more for their trophies.
Handicaps need to be capped, the way Danny Zags is going it will get to a point
were he may go on last and the game might not be able to be finished.
Danny`s to be capped at -200. +150 the other way.
Usher Cup to be renamed the Aldridge Cup in recognition of Tony`s efforts over
the years for in promoting Billiards and Snooker in the town.
I mention the above as I don't think we will be able to fit Tonys idea in and
I didn't quite understand it either.
NOT CARRIED
PROPOSALS AND SUGGESTIONS FOR 2016 AGM
ARE NOW CLOSED
1. No limit on minus h/cap all players treated the same
Proposed by Mike Thatcher, Shirley Cons 7.6.2016
AMENDMENT MADE BY TONY ALDRIDGE
NO CEILING FOR MINUS OR PLUS HANDICAPS - CARRIED
2. Stuart Hamper competition
As this is the most entered and longest to run, A round of the Stuart Hamper to be played after each 1/4 of league games, this makes even more sense as we will have nine teams
for the new season.
Proposed by Chris Christodoulou, Park Gate RBL 11.7.2016
AMENDMENT MADE
COMPETITION TO BE RUN AFTER EACH THIRD CYCLE OF LEAGUE MATCHES - CARRIED
3. String for game start instead of coin toss
Instead of the toss of a coin for choice of break, I propose that we string for choice, as they do in the more senior forms of the game. This is just to add something different into the evening.
Proposed by Derek Fry, Curdridge RBL 26.7.2016
Seconded by Paul Adams
CARRIED
PROPOSALS AND SUGGESTIONS FOR 2015 AGM
1. Snooker individuals from last season to be played
oct/nov/dec this will also be were it will be played in future years,
we don't start any other competitions until the new year. Perfect time to have it.
IT WAS DECIDED THAT THE RESULTS SECRETARY WILL SEND SINGLES ENTRIES TO CHRIS CHRISTODOULOU WHO WILL ORGANISE THE COMPETITION
2. Idea for end of season billiard competition.
Top eights players of the season will be drawn into two groups of four,
to qualify for this points will be:
any league match win and team cup win 2 points
senior billards and Stuart Hamper handicap comps 5 points a win.
If Paul has the time or wants to maybe we can have up to date rankings for players
or once a month and maybe a small cup for the player ranked 1 at the end of season.
Draw for groups to be made at end of last league or competition match.
Seeds 1 and 2 to be in different groups, then seed 3 will be dawn, seed 4
will then be put into the other group, seed 5 will be drawn so seed 6 would be
put in the other group etc.
First matches in the groups will have top seed play lowest seed in group,
then the two winners will play next game in group.( this should ensure that
come last games in group all or at least 3 could qualify for semis)
Two points for a win in group matches, if there is a tie at the end of the group
stages your F points to count, still a tie then head to head to count, still a tie then
your A will count.
The above to be played on one night, with the top two in each group going
through to the semi-finals.
Semis and finals to be played on one night:
Winner group 1 v runners up group 2
winner group 2 v runners up group 1
From Chris Christodoulou (Park Gate RBL)
RESULTS SECRETARY WILL LOOK INTO FEASABILITY OF RUNNING AN OPEN (HANDICAPPED) COMPETITION AT A SUITABLE CLUB, TO BE PLAYED AT THE END OF THE 2015-2016 SEASON
PROPOSALS AND SUGGESTIONS FOR 2014 AGM
CHRIS CHRISTODOULOU NOT PRESENT AT AGM. NO SECONDER FOR ANY POINTS.
1. End of season Singles 50 point shoot out.
first to 50 no handicaps, format will be done in groups:
I.e 4 groups of 4 (4 groups at different venues)depending on entries, all points scored count, so
everybody still has a chance even in their final game, if their is a tie
on points then frames won count, if still a tie then head to head counts.
All group winners to play on finals night and play same format as above.
2. Chandlers Ford to be banned from coming season Usher Cup.
Reasons: they fielded an eligible player in their semi-final against
Sarisbury Green, Salisbury Green should have been reinstated.
Chandlers Ford played 2 eligible players in the final.
Rules stated and agreed from last meeting, players had to play a
minimum of 6 league games to play in any ko competition.
After semi-final win against Sarisbury Terry admitted he had made a
mistake and thought rule applied to single ko completion's.
John Mullane, when first round draw was played of senior billards,
John hadn`t played enough league games, but he had a bye, when
the next round was played he had played enough league games.
How do we look at this? Has Chandlers ford broke the rules again?
I did say at last years meeting if you were a defending champion you
should be allowed to defend your title, this was knocked back.
Totton Rec Player Matt Osboune played in the Jim Watts doubles competion
when he hadn`t played enough league games.
I know we are a friendly league, but rules are rules, we can not be seen to have
one rule for another team and another rule for the rest of the league.
We need to be firm on this.
Well done to Paul and the team on well run and organised season last year.
An amendment was made to the cup competition rules
CUP COMPETITIONS
ALL PLAYERS ENTERING INDIVIDUAL AND TEAM CUP COMPETITIONS MUST HAVE PLAYED AT LEAST 6 BILLIARD LEAGUE MATCHES, AT ANY TIME, IN ANY SEASON (amendment from 2014 AGM).
PROPOSALS AND DECISIONS TAKEN AT 2013 AGM
TERRY AZOR, CHANDLERS FORD CENTRAL
Hi Paul
Last minute I know if rolling handicaps do come in I like to amend with limits both ways ie.-170 and +140 plus also still have handicaps adjusted by the handicap committee and not a final say by the chairman. (AMENDED TO +130 FOR MAXIMUM + FIGURE). CARRIED
Also some league games snooker tables where not prepared not brushed or ironed, as rule for match balls tables must be done. CARRIED
thanks
terry azor
NICK WOOD, HAMBLE SOCIAL
Hi Paul
Here are a few ideas I have:
I like the idea of the rolling handicap adjustment (+5, -5). This should be easy enough to maintain, as long as you receive the electronic scorecards in a timely manner. However it may be more work for you to, for example, publish an updated handicap list each week. CARRIED
Wayne's idea of a bonus point or points for a 6-0 is a really good one and he makes a valid point about people protecting handicaps. NOT CARRIED
I think a billiards pairs competition needs to be introduced. Chris mentioned this, but how about also having two players from different clubs pairing up? Get all the entries in and then draw the pairs out of the hat. Would be good for inter-team relations. NOT CARRIED, BUT AMENDED AS PER CHRIS CHRISTODOULOU'S SUGGESTION
To be allowed to participate in the knockout competitions players must play a minimum number of league games. At least a third. (AMENDED TO 'PLAYED AT LEAST 6 LEAGUE GAMES'). CARRIED
Please keep the league running on three cycles of fixtures. We do not want to end up with a short billiards season. CARRIED
Lastly one that is bound to open a can of worms - there needs to be a maximum handicap given to super league and high standard snooker players. I would suggest that +30 is fair, but that is open to debate. The 'bandit' problem has always been a contentious issue. AMENDED TO +50. CARRIED
Regards
WAYNE CROTTY, HYTHE SOCIAL
just a small suggestion from hythe lads is, we like the 3 points for a win and 1 point for a draw, we also think if you win 6-0 you get an extra 2 bonus points. this does not happen often but if a player going on last knows they have won it gives them a little more incentive to win, especially if they have won their last 4 games in a row and they might not be bothered because of the handicap drop. NOT CARRIED
MIKE THATCHER, WOOLSTON CONS
1 rename to southampton and district billiards association. NOT CARRIED
2 scrap all snooker comps. NOT CARRIED
3 start league on sept 18. NOT CARRIED
4 no Thursday matches. NOT CARRIED
5 play all cup comps at the end of league season. NOT CARRIED
6 teams must play all league matches. CARRIED
7 keep points system the same as is. CARRIED
CHRIS CHRISTODOULOU, BITTERNE RBL
Afternnon Paul,
my proposals are:
like the idea 3points for a win and 1 for the draw, this will make the league closer.
NOT CARRIED
snooker doubles to be scrapped,and replaced with billards doubles ken syndenham style(lowest handicap out of partnership that is what doubles team start with) CARRIED
snooker individual to stay. CARRIED
riley shield to stay with a differance(same format but matches 2 snooker and 2 billards matches(handicap scores as normal) if tie level home team choose if they play snooker or billards.(this needs to be drawn on night of matches,so no one knows who their playing and they dont know if they will be playing billards or snooker) NOT CARRIED. it is important we keep a little bit of snooker after all the league is called: Southampton and Billards Snooker Asscation SDBSA.
People need to play at least 1/3 of billard league matches(as we play 3 cycles) to be allowed to play in knockout competitions at end of season.(not an unreasonble request)(AMENDED TO PLAYED AT LEAST 6 LEAGUE GAMES). CARRIED
What do you think Paul,
have a greeat summer.
regards
PAUL LAWRENCE, BITTERNE RBL
Hi Paul
Just an idea, but I really liked your thoughts about a rolling Handicap system.
+5 for a loss, - 5 for a win. CARRIED
Put it forward from me if necessary
Best wishes
Paul L